YJ swap questions

[my996duc1]

I am thinking of changing over to the YJ springs for a better ride and more flex.. but I have a few questions.
I am currently running a Trail Tough deluxe Spoa kit with BonzEye 2" lift springs. It came with shocks, longer brake lines, ect...

I would like to keep it street friendly as I like to drive it to work a few days a week.

- How much lift does the YJ springs give ? Looking for a 4 pack front 5 pack rear. (trying to stay about the same lift as what I have with the 2" BonzEye lift springs.)

- What about missing links...  I notice alot of people run fronts but not as many run rear... are the rear missing links not street friendly ?

- Panhard kit - thoughts ?

- Anything else that I need to think about or consider with the YJ swap, keeping in mind I am trying to stay the same lift height as what I already have (pinion angle, steering, different shocks and mounts, longer brake lines)

-Also, any specs on YJ springs so I will know I am looking at the correct ones ? I plan on trying to find a used set off craigslist and don't want to be sold a set that isn't from a YJ.

Thank you for the input.
I would like to do this conversion myself but would hate to mess it all up and cause a bunch of other problems.


.

[Skyman]

I replied over o the other forum, hope it helps
--Sky

[my996duc1]

Thanks for the reply.
The other forum has all types of responses and this one has had nothing over here.... maybe the other forum is more geared towards this type of questions.

[abraham_monge]

I replied over o the other forum, hope it helps
--Sky

could you give the link for that forum please, because I'm thinking in install YJ in my Zuk
thanks and regards.

[Skyman]

Missing links in the rear work fine on the road. I've had mine on and off road for 2 years now with no issues, and we do some mean trails. We also took a trip to cannon beach (5 days on the road), and 600 miles. We drove I-5 at 65 MPH, the mountain passes (white pass) comfortably with traffic. We were alos loaded down pretty heavy. I would prefer the TT missing links in the rear VS a longer shackle for a couple of reasons.

#1 less leverage on the spring for a more stable ride.
#2 less spring wrap with a shorter shackle, less vibration

Now for the lift part, it looks like the kit you bought from TT was the same kit I bought, minus the parts for the YJ's. I bought the TT deluxe SPOA YJ swap kit with high steer. It;s basically a SPOA with YJ stuff added. I netted a little under 6 inches of total lift. 33's clear fine.

As for a pan-hard, it's not really needed to drive comfortably, but it will give you amuch more responsive steering, and a tighter overall feel. A good steering stabilizer setup right will make a dramatic difference. It did for me. Now I was comfortable before, but it seems like every little thing I do just makes it that much better.

If you do not have drive shaft extensions yet, you will need them. I used a 2" slip yoke in the rear and two spacers up front. After messing with the springs a bit and driving it, I strongly recommend at least one more inch of drive shaft up front. The front started making an awful noise i thought was the transfer case. It turned out that the splines on the front yoke wore down from being too short and allowing the sjhaft to wobble. Adding 1 extra inch up front cured the noise and the vibration. As for the rear, it really depends on the spring but it is possible you will need one more inch back there too, for a total of 3 inches to both shafts.

Remember in the rear you need a slip yoke. Drive shaft spacers will make your drive line angle worse and cause some issues. Up front, you need a space on the t-case end to clear your cross member. I believe one spacer, and a slip yoke up front would be perfect.

If you need longer shocks, I have the doestech 8000's that came with my kit. They had about 500 miles on them before I found a killer deal on some rancho adjustables. Drop me a P.M. if you are interested.

As for springs, this is what I learned, for a soft spring you need a stiff shock, and for a stiff spring you need a soft shock. Your needs will be different than everyone else depending on the load you carry, the weight of your bumpers, cage and winch (base vehicle weight) 4 packs work fine in the rear for me, but I rarely carry a heavy load. When I do, I just jack up the rancho's to #4 and I am good. For some one carrying weight in the rear, or full sized passengers, a 5 pack, or even hybrid 6 pck may suit them better.

Hope some of that helps, a lot of us (including me) are perfectionists when it comes to our YJ suspensions, either that or we just have too much time on our hands If you have any more questions feel free to ask away.

[abraham_monge]

 
 thank you very much.

[abraham_monge]

OK Sky this are my doubts,
Can I Install SPOA YJ without Missing Link and how the car could work in off roading,
I'll like to install Missing Link but in Costa Rica is to expensive to import some parts from  USA, I want to leave my car with  31 or 32 MT Tires because i want to install a lock right in the rear axle, what do you think about the Spoa YJ without Missin Link, the angle of my shackle could be terrible? or can I build like a boomerang shackle?
thanks.

[HardLuk]

The YJ's will not just bolt up with a shackle.  You have to either do a frame extention (welded on and reinforced with fish plating) or do a Missing Link setup, which can be made. 

I would stick with rears up front though.  There's better approach angle and the flex is good, plus you don't have to make or buy Missing Links or do a frame extention....But, if you are dead set on the YJ's, I would look into buying a Rocky Road bolt on frame extention for YJ's from either E-bay, a member here selling a kit, or direct from Rocky Road.  There are some people who have made copies of the kit, and maybe someone would make you a copy and send it direct to you for a good price.

 

[samurayo]

But as far as I've seen with the kits. They simply use a relocation bracket and give you the choice of missing links or shackles in the back and use missing links in the front. I don't understand why the frame extension? Or is that assuming that the relocation plates/brackets aren't used?

The only thing I can see that would be troublesome is not using the missing links in the front.

[Skyman]

Exactly in the rear you can use a relocation bracket with YJ's and not use missing links. Look at the Sky manufacturing YJ kit, they use a shackle in the rear no problems.

You are right in the front you run into problems without using the missing links. The YJ springs are just too long to mount without having a missing link, or like rocky roads, a bolt on extension in the front. The front is about approx 4 inches longer than the stock spring. Using a relocation bracket  you may be able to get away with along shackle, but I would not recommend a long shackle for the front.

Do you have any welding abilities, or access to a welder? If so the front would be an easy job for you. It has been done so the pictures are out there. Like I said the rear, it is near bolt on it works good in the rear with a plain shackle. I also like the way it handles like this. Look at rocky roads kit to get an idea of what you need to do in the front, and sky-manufacturing for an idea on the rear.

Sorry I haven;t been around lately I am getting ready for the tillamook event "powerfest 09" and I will be gone until Monday. I'll be here until tomorrow if you have any more questions, I am happy to help.

[samurayo]

I'll take a look at the Rocky Road kit in more detail. As for the Sky Skit I've looked at it and am pretty sure that's the way we're going to go in the rear. As for a welder, yes I have access to a welder (machine) but the problems is finding a good welder (person) or one that isn't excessively expensive. The reason for staying away from the missing links is that it would have to be a homemade job do to shipping costs and not quite confident on the geometry needed for the missing links. The concept is very easy. basically two shackles put together by a bushing but I don't think that a good working non dangerous for daily driving missing link can be THAT easy. We have looked at the TT missing link kit extensively since it seems to be the one most people are using, so maybe we'll try to emulate that.

And actually I do have a question that arose after reading the SPOA post by hondalowlow and someone mentioned that having a flat spring plate is not advisable because it will bend around the leafs with the pressure of the U-bolts. Thing is for the YJ kit I was thinking of having some plates but out of 1/4" or 3/8" flat steel, so I need to know just how unwanted is a flat spring plate??

Well, thank you very much for all of your help.
Once again thank you very much for the help

[abraham_monge]

thank you guys for all your help, maybe we going to build some shackle like the pictures for the rear, but M/L I don't know how works in freeway, I only have my Zuk and I use it for my job.
It could be great use M/L but in Costa Rica we have a company who checks the cars one time in the year so i don't know if they gonna accept that modification.
If i build 4 pairs of shackle like the pics could be works good? or the front shackles need to be longer than the rear, how long I need the shackles?
thanks for your help
regards,
Abraham

[abraham_monge]

[HardLuk]

Yes, it may not be so good to make your own missing links and expect it do drive as well as the Trail Tough Missing Links on road.  Off road homemade missing links would be fine, but on road they may wander more than aftermarket (Trail Tough or Sky), plus like was said maybe not pass inspection.

As for making a shackle like in the picture to go from the stock front shackle mount to a much LONGER YJ spring, I'm thinking the angle would be pretty steep and the shackle very long (longer than the ones pictured) and potentially worse for driving than any missing link.  The angle may be so steep that under full compression the spring may hit where the shackle mounts at the frame, and the shackle may, at that point, be completely straight out and flat (parallel to the ground).

As for relocation plates, yes the YJ kits all have these.  Just like the ones I have seen pictured for the RUF you guys have made, but the kits also have either missing links or a frame extention to make up the extra difference in spring length as well.

I still think if somehow possible your best bet is to get a Rocky Road like bolt on frame adapter/extention w/shackles (shackles could be made fairly easily).  Then, if you had to, for the one time vehicle check each year you could switch back to stock or RUF, or whatever it is that passes, and then switch back to YJ's the rest of the year.


 

[samurayo]

Then, if you had to, for the one time vehicle check each year you could switch back to stock or RUF, or whatever it is that passes, and then switch back to YJ's the rest of the year.

That would be doable since we have to change tires and some other things anyway to pass. I do believe that the easiest thing to do is the frame extension like the one in the RRO kit but maybe with a few less nuts and bolts. The one thing I can´t tell from the pics is how long the extension is. Because with Abraham´s aftermarket bumper we might have some issues there. But I think that in the end, the best thing is going to be to have the YJ´s on hand and put them on the relocation brackets and then measure to see how far out they go. Then with that measurement make the frame extension.

Once again, thank you for the help. It´s all been very valuable and actually sorry for the Hi-Jack!!!